When Bro. Hodapp told the world last week that the newly sworn-in governor of New York, David Paterson, was a Freemason, I was elated that finally there was an upright and honorable Mason in the public spotlight, one who would help restore Freemasonry's image, most recently tarnished by the Royal Order of Jesters prostitute story from upstate New York.Alas, Bro. Paterson hadn't even moved his stuff into the governor's mansion before he announced that both he and his wife had had extramarital affairs. Less than a week later, the news is splashed with his "confessions" that he has used cocaine and marijuana.
As a libertarian, I don't care what he's done regarding sex or drugs. Probably half the adults in America have done similar things. In my opinion, his "transgressions" have no bearing on his ability to carry out the duties of his office. He's to be admired for 'fessing up, I suppose, not because he should have, but because sooner or later a reporter would have brought it up anyway.
But as a Freemason, I'm a bit saddened. A public figure like Gov. Paterson could have led to Freemasonry gaining some positive press, and led me to write an inspiring, upbeat, positively glowing, triumphant article about the return of quality Masonic leadership.
Instead, he's reinforced our image as partying sex addicts.
More on the Royal Jesters story out of Buffalo
Speaking of partying, sex-crazed Masons.... Former police chief, former Jester (recent news articles say he's been "kicked out" of the club) and former (I assume) Masonic brother John Trowbridge pleaded guilty last Thursday to transporting a woman from New York to Kentucky to provide prostitution services at a Royal Order of Jesters get-together in 2005. He also admitted to taking a hooker to a Jester event in Pennsylvania in 2006.
Also charged in the case were former New York Supreme Court Justice Ron Tills and his law clerk, Michael Stebick. Presumably both men have not yet made a plea and will stand trial for violation of the federal Mann Act.
"Mirth Missives"
Investigative reporter Sandy Frost has apparently angered certain Jesters with her recent articles. A February 2008 issue of a privately-owned, "unofficial" Jester-oriented newsletter titled Mirth Missives carried this comment atop its front page:
A self styled "Investigative reporter, author and researcher into that which would rather remain hidden" named Sandy Frost, who lives in the Seattle area, has acquired the name and phone numbers of many Jesters. She is calling them to get an interview to bash the ROJ. You know what to do is [sic] she calls you. You can read her poison at:In a recent article, Ms. Frost described the contents of the newsletter as being so "pornographic as well as so sexually, racially and religiously offensive, that I will not link to it."
http://sandyfrost.newsvine.com
Please communicate this information to your fellow Jesters at your next Court or Biliken [sic] Club gathering.
I don't agree with her that the contents are truly pornographic, but they are crude, juvenile, sexist and racist. The quality of the "humor" and the general layout of the e-zine remind me of something a 13-year old would create and enjoy.
Mirth Missives is peppered with cartoons that appear to be from a Playboy-type magazine. One comic panel shows a man, pants around his ankles, bending over a doctor's examining table. The caption reads, "Don't be embarrassed. You think your [sic] the first guy whose wife shoved the remote up his ass?"
There are several jokes about Viagra, including a "Fricke Door Sign," which reads: "I'm on Prozac, Rogaine and Viagra. I'm happy, hairy and horny."
One photo, intended to be "mirthful," I assume, shows an older couple sitting on a park bench, with the man reaching inside the woman's blouse. A caption added by TazMack, the publisher, says, "Fricke Spotted in the Park Last Week." Apparently, Fricke is a dentist and fellow Jester that TazMack often kids in the newsletter.
Another photo shows a man holding a sign that says, "Sorry. I'm blind. Can I feel your tits?"
If you read the comments section on Ms. Frost's article, you'll note that Mirth Missives publisher TazMack has been raising hell over the "leak" of his newsletter (he's the one who sent her a sample issue) and the list of several hundred subscribers, claiming "copyright violation." Amusingly (the only thing amusing about the newsletter), there's very little in the newsletter that is original. Other than the pokes at Fricke, the opening bit that warns about Ms. Frost's "poison," a disclaimer and one other small section that I will refrain from discussing at this time (read Sandy's article and TazMack's comment — yeah, the part about controlled drugs), all the material has been copied from other sources.
In respect of TazMack's claim of "copyright," I'm refraining from publishing the entire contents of the newsletter or linking to it. The use of snippets from the newsletter that I'm publishing here falls under the Fair Use Clause. The fact that the newsletter itself contains explicit instructions on how to forward it pretty much demolishes any claim that the newsletter is a "protected communication."
Do Not Forward This Entire E-Mail
If you decide to forward a joke or jokes via e-mail, please use your "copy and paste" feature to send just the joke, removing the headers, footers, addresses and unsuitable material.
Here's how to do it:
Point to the first letter of the text you want to copy and left click and hold down and drag the pointer to the end of the text and then let up on the left button. Now hover the pointer over the highlighted text and right click and choose copy from the pull down menu. Now open a new fresh write mail form and point to the main body of the new mail and right click and then touch on paste. Wham the copied text is pasted into your mail. Now select the subject and who you want to send it to and touch on send.
OR
Go to the joke or information you want to send. You can press control+shift+end to select to the end of the document or control+shift+down arrow to the end of the joke. Then, press control+c for copy. Then create a new message and then press control+v to paste the information.
Here's the e-zine's disclaimer:
"Mirth Missives is not for everyone. Particularly in business settings, some of the material may be problematic, possibly leading to sexual harassment or unlawful discrimination charges. To protect you and me, please do not receive Mirth Missives on a computer at your place of employment, or on a computer owned or installed at any fraternal or civic organization site. If you decide to print a copy of Mirth Missives, treat it as you would any other confidential mail and do not leave it lying around for prying eyes."In closing, let me leave you with a joke or two from Mirth Missives. [Warning: Contains the F-word.]
A parrot developed the bad habit of screwing the farmer's hens, making them quit laying.Mirth really is king, huh?
The farmer tells the parrot if he does it again he will pull out every feather in the parrot's head.
The next day, the farmer again catches the parrot humping a hen, and snatches the parrot bald.
The following day, the farmer's wife hosts a formal dinner. She thinks it would be unique if the parrot greeted the guests and told them where to go. She had spent nearly a year training the parrot for this.
As the guests began entering, the parrot dutifully announced, "Ladies to the right! Gentlemen to the left!"
Spotting two bald guys entering, the parrot says, "And you two chicken-fuckers get up here with me."
Oh, sorry. Was that not funny? What about this one?
Abe went to a brothel and told the madam, "I want a girl with big boobs and a small box."I guess if your humor-meter is still stuck in the sixth grade and you spend your time at church trying to look up women's dresses, you might find Mirth Missives your "cup of tea," suitable for any private "men's organization."
"Why?" she asked him.
"Never mind!" replied Abe. "I`m paying for it. I want a girl with big tits and a small cooze!"
"No problem," said the madam. "Go straight up the stairs to room 23."
A few minutes later there was a knock on the door, and a young woman walked in.
"Okay," she said, "are you the guy with the big mouth and the small pecker?"
But these men are Freemasons. These are the "pillars of the community." Many of these men are present or past "illustrious potentates" and 33rd degree poobahs. The publisher of Mirth Missives wears a 33rd degree white hat.
These are men I once told my son to seek out if he was ever in trouble. These are men I once assumed I could trust to behave themselves around my wife.
"Oh, W.S. It's just a small minority, a few horny old men. They're harmless. It's all in good, clean fun. Masons are all good, decent family men dedicated to the good of the community and 'making good men better.' It's just an isolated event."
I've seen the distribution list of Mirth Missives. I was very surprised at some of the names on the list. I immediately recognized at least one as a Past Grand Master, and I'm sure there are others of such "high rank." All the names on the list, I would assume, are now, or once were, active officers in their blue lodges. These are the "leaders" who instructed new candidates in rituals and lectures regarding "morality" and "keeping passions within due bounds."
Personally — again, as a libertarian — I don't care what these guys are doing. Yuck it up, boys. Take your Viagra and **** yourselves silly.
I just find it disturbing that you're doing it en masse under the banner of a group associated with Freemasonry.
We're supposed to be better than this.
Masons | Royal Order of Jesters | Mirth Missives | Freemasonry | Shriners | Burning Taper | BurningTaper.com
I agree whole-heartedly. As Masons we are to not hold ourselves to a higher standard, but also our fellow brothers. We should never bring shame to the Craft, especially not in this manner. I pray that these men see the error of their ways, and find a way to attempt to repair the damage they've done to themselves, their families, their communities, and the Fraternity. Time, as always, will tell. Great informative post Brother, God bless you!
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI think I was in 6th grade when I heard that parrot joke before.
ReplyDeleteYou are spot on with this, and if this is what the fraternity of the seekers of light have degenerated into, then so be it, but its shameful. From the purest of level, is this something that these illustrious men would want their grand children to read? Or is it just another "seekret" that is hidden in Freemasonry?
If this is institutional behavior, then really, shame on them.
What it seems like, to me, is an institutional disassociation of what the group is doing and what the group represents. Sure this is an offshoot in that it is the "Jesters", but so long as it is within the frame of Freemasonry, then it is deplorable.
But then, what do we know, were just a bunch of bloggers.
The further you get from Freemasonry, the further you get from Freemaosnry. I love being a Mason and a Shriner, but I could never participate in any of the activities these folks are accused of arranging.
ReplyDeleteBen R.
The Jesters incident in made national news years ago. This is not news, just another piece of someone not living up to what they should. Yes, it is unfortunate that these incidents happen. They do happen.
ReplyDeleteOf course, it's all according to their freedom of conscience. If they were in the Grand Orient, there'd never be a problem with doing this. There would never be a problem with abandoning people in your care to possible death (as one member did on a dangerous climb he was in charge of) in the Grand Orient. Ritual slaying of stray cats is fine too with the Grand Orient. There would never be a problem with illegally keeping track of the personal religious beliefs of military officers in the Grand Orient. I find the preceeding action to be far more heinous than what the Jesters are purported to have done. The Grand Orient never kicks anyone out, and welcomes anyone into their ranks if they so wish. Everything's fine by them; everything's masonic to them. We put people on trial for child molestation, as WS reported here. The G.O., no. It's all good to them. Cat-killing, leaving people to die, lying copiously, abusing military power to keep track of officers-fine, fine. Not with me. Not with most masons I personally know.
This is indeed, a sad case. We cannot control the actions of every brother, nor should we. They are responsible to their conscience. If they go to far, they should be removed. There's room for them in the Grand Orient if they want to remain in a psuedo-masonic body where they can do all of these things with no fear of punishment. Obviously, the individuals discussed here will be punished-by the law of the country and by Masonic repurcussions, as was documented on the major news sources in that story in the wayback machine.
Grand Orient NY Times article
Aleister Crowley: "The Beast Demystified" by Roger Hutchinson
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletePersonally — again, as a libertarian — I don't care what these guys are doing. Yuck it up, boys. Take your Viagra and **** yourselves silly.
ReplyDeleteI just find it disturbing that you're doing it en masse under the banner of a group associated with Freemasonry.
WS, I think I'm confused about your perspective. On one hand, you say that it's fine for them to go off and do what they want. I understand that - it's a libertarian viewpoint.
Yet you follow that up with a sense of disappointment that they are doing what they want.
We're supposed to be better than this.
Here's what I don't get. Better than what, exactly? A bunch of 14 year olds? Yeah, the humor is juvenile, but I'm wondering if you meant that there is an inherent wrongness about it.
I mean, is it okay, or isn't it? And if it's not, then is it because you really think that there's something wrong with what they're doing?
No argument, just curiosity.
Bro. Tom wrote:
ReplyDeleteWS, I think I'm confused about your perspective. On one hand, you say that it's fine for them to go off and do what they want. I understand that - it's a libertarian viewpoint.
Yet you follow that up with a sense of disappointment that they are doing what they want.
Here's what I don't get. Better than what, exactly? A bunch of 14 year olds? Yeah, the humor is juvenile, but I'm wondering if you meant that there is an inherent wrongness about it.
I mean, is it okay, or isn't it? And if it's not, then is it because you really think that there's something wrong with what they're doing?
No argument, just curiosity.
Simple, Bro. Tom. I don't judge (an intellectual activity) their actions or morals as good or bad. How they choose to act is how they choose to act.
Yet I feel an emotional reaction at how they act. That emotion is disappointment.
It goes to the heart of what I feel Freemasonry should be, per the generally accepted qualities and characteristics of a Mason, vis-a-vis what it really is or what it appears to be. I'm disappointed that a certain percentage of Masons — apparently a large percentage — choose to act in what many would consider "immoral" or "unmasonic" ways.
It's like I wrote in Small Town Freemasonry — Part 4: Masonic Coverups, Collusion and Cronyism, "...I believe that things should be what they say they are. For example, I 'need' for police officers and government officials to be honest and not corrupt, I 'need' for medical doctors to be wise and to have their patients' best interest at heart, and I 'need' for religious leaders to be sincere and to follow their own religious teachings... and in the case of Freemasonry, I need for Masons to act as Masons."
After my years in the Masonic trenches, I've even gotten over the fact that many Masons don't exhibit the expected characteristics of "good men" in control of their passions.
But emotionally, I still occasionally feel the sadness, disappointment and even embarrassment over the antics of Masons.
Even as I write about it.
Some of my detractors think I take delight in posting the foibles of Masons. I don't.
I'm just driven to document them. Sometimes I'm Edward R. Murrow. Sometimes I'm Mike Wallace. Sometimes I'm Andy Rooney. Sometimes I'm Jon Stewart.
To those who say I shouldn't write about the negative things in Masonry, I say this: I will stop, as soon as Masons stop doing negative things that need to be written about.
— W.S.
I get email from a brother in a nearby town. Our part of the midwest is a tad more conservative than my birthplace of Berkeley, CA, and many of the emails he chooses to forward I find extremely offensive. However, I remain on his mailing list because, now and then, there is a worthwhile piece of information: a lodge needs some help with a degree, a brother has health problems -- like that. I haven't asked him to filter his humor on one side and the useful information on the other. To him, it's all useful information (we need to know what the Mexicans are going to do to us when they Take Over the US).
ReplyDeleteIn other cases I receive offensive email which I did not sign up for.
My point being, don't use the distribution list to condemn the recipients.
We already know that many of us have not perfected our ashlars.
Call me pollyanna, but I believe those Masons who enjoy that humor would be courteous and respectful to your wife, give aid and succor to your son, should he ask, and otherwise take his obligation seriously. No matter what makes them laugh, they're still Masons.
Francois-Marie:
ReplyDeleteWe have several stray cats in our area. Right now I'm practicing the Fellowcraft ritual, but there's nothing in it with cats.
What ritual do you use with stray cats?
Which reminds me, I need to move some of their songs on to my ipod.
"Good try at propaganda Francois but misinformation and lies only detract from your credibility."
ReplyDeleteProve that they are lies. If you cannot (and you CANNOT), it GREATLY detracts from your credibility. Voltaire was a member of the Grand Orient for about a month before his death-not an enormous 'career' there. Franklin was a great man, purported to belong to the Hell Fire Club in France as well, a club that make the Jesters seem tame by comparison. I'm surprised you'd expect either of these men to deny the truth. That Grand Orient that Frankin and Voltaire joined is dead. They would find denying the FACTS as deplorable.
You claim this is not the truth-now all you have to do is back up your claims. You cannot, you will not. It is ALL true. If it is not, you can show it here.
YOU said:
"I believe there is a better way of doing things; a way where all who desire to be among us as a Freemason are welcomed."
That means that all those who are kicked out of Masonry can join you and be 'among you as a Freemason' without having to prove ANYTHING about their right to the name.
I do applaud the HONEST efforts of those fighting for reform. I do NOT applaud witch-hunts against all the brethren based on the actions of a few. Witch hunts are deplorable.
"Who's payroll are you on? The Grand Lodge of California? I think I know."
You think you know a lot. It doesn't make it so.
So, Howard; PROVE that these items are NOT true. Easy for you to do if they are not. They ARE true.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteRoyce Meyers wrote:
ReplyDelete"We have several stray cats in our area. Right now I'm practicing the Fellowcraft ritual, but there's nothing in it with cats.
What ritual do you use with stray cats?Which reminds me, I need to move some of their songs on to my ipod."
Obviously, regular Masonry does not use cats, stray or otherwise. Never said that the Grand Orient does either. Only that members of the G.O. have, in the past, sacrificed cats and made a follower of theirs drink the blood, possibly causing the follower's demise. This is utter ignorance at best and would not be a person I could sit with just because they 'desire to be among us as a Freemason'.
We will wait to see if Howard can prove these documents are NOT true; something he cannot do. I will be amazed if they are not, but will accept it if new information proves them otherwise. Amaze me, Howard-please. The flu isn't helping.
Bro. Royce wrote:
ReplyDeleteI get email from a brother... [that] I find extremely offensive. However, I remain on his mailing list because, now and then, there is a worthwhile piece of information....
My point being, don't use the distribution list to condemn the recipients....
Call me pollyanna, but I believe those Masons who enjoy that humor would be courteous and respectful to your wife, give aid and succor to your son, should he ask, and otherwise take his obligation seriously. No matter what makes them laugh, they're still Masons.
Well, I guess that's where you and I differ, Bro. Royce. When I first became a Mason, members of my lodge and other local lodges began sending me dirty jokes and lots of rah-rah redneck patriotic love-it-or-leave it stuff. I politely asked the originators — several times — to stop sending it. Eventually I had to get downright aggressive in my requests for them to stop.
Your argument, my brother, is weak. If you're offended by certain emails, why do you allow them into your mailbox? If you're offended by something a brother is sending, is it not your duty to "nudge his elbow" and let him know you don't like it. Otherwise, you're like a woman whose husband beats her almost everyday, but who stays with him because every once in a while, he gives her a hug.
Are you trying merely to maintain "peace and harmony" by not expressing your distaste? Back when porn spam was such a problem online, did you not occasionally contact an ISP or try to install a spam filter? Do you just open your emailbox to any and all "offensive" material? What if your Masonic buddy was mailing hardcopies to your house, with a great big square and compasses on it so your family would know it was Masonic business? Would you want your wife and children to read it?
So yeah, I'm gonna have to accept your offer and call you "Pollyanna."
Just because only 10% of Catholic priests are pedophiles doesn't mean I'd ever let my son be an altar boy.
Likewise, I wouldn't want my son or wife (I'm no longer married, but the point is the same) around any Jester, knowing what I know.
— W.S.
The first reply post from 'blessed beggar' is exactly how I feel on this matter.
ReplyDeleteIf I get a dirty and offensive e-mail, it's often from my wife. I expect it from her. What I don't expect Howard to be able to provide any evidence against the information provided about the Grand Orient.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI've never seen any cats at Grand Orient lodges, but I have seen live goats at both Georgia and Kentucky Master Mason degrees.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete"You PROVE that it is true. You posted it, not me. Why should I waste my time doing research for you."
ReplyDeleteJust as I thought-you CAN'T prove it.
It's YOUR responsibility to back up your assertion that these sources were lying or erronious, not mine to prove these well-documented facts. Put up or shut up, Howard. Otherwise, my assertions stand strong-unlike your credibility.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete"Francois seems to be baiting others with his comments which have no relation to the posted article."
ReplyDeleteIt is indeed, a distressing story about the Jesters. However, it does indeed relate, as the Grand Orient should be investigated for corruption and said investigations should be applauded by its members. It also relates as Howard stated that these individuals, despite their misdeeds, would be welcome at the Grand Orient.
Howard is just a fundamentalist for his cause. I won't pretend I am not, but I further admit that some individuals who belonged to the fraternity have performed misdeeds. These are punished when discovered, more often than not. I applaud the revelations and the punishments of these individuals, but I balk at the witch hunts attempted to label all Masons with the sins of a few. Guilty by association is not right. Still, Howard wanted further proof-here's some, and much more to be had: The Encyclopedia Britannica article about corrupt General Andre, member of the Grand Orient of France
From: 'Confessions of Crowley'
"I had been told "A cat has nine lives." I deduced that it must be practically impossible to kill a cat. As usual, I became full of ambition to perform the feat. (Observe that I took my information unquestioningly au pied de la lettre.) Perhaps through some analogy with the story of Hercules and the hydra, I got it into my head that the nine lives of the cat must be taken more or less simultaneously. I therefore caught a cat, and having administered a large dose of arsenic I chloroformed it, hanged it above the gas jet, stabbed it, cut its throat, smashed its skull and, when it had been pretty thoroughly burnt, drowned it and threw it out of the window that the fall might remove the ninth life. In fact, the operation was successful; I had killed the cat. I remember that all the time I was genuinely sorry for the animal; I simply forced myself to carry out the experiment in the interest of pure science."
Crowley claimed to be a Mason. Howard said 'all who desire to be among us as a Freemason are welcomed.' Crowley, in HIS OWN WORDS, admitted to killing the cat. In my estimation, but not in Howard's this is not the act of a Mason.
Seeing a goat in a lodge and KILLING anything are two different matters, and I never claimed a cat was killed in a lodge. Crowley, on the other hand, killed a cat and purportedly had relations with a goat. Despite the goat purportedly surviving, it probably would have preferred death. Of course, ask Howard for evidence of ANY KIND, and he will refuse. Watch him do so now! No amount of evidence will ever be enough for a fanatic like Howard. The freethinkers will see through this ruse.
"The claim is yours. It is, therefore, your responsibility to prove your assertion or be laughed at by serious scholars."
ReplyDeleteYes, but were you successful? We've seen that you know next to nothing about Spinoza already. You can quote and read this individual, but unless you feel him in your heart it doesn't mean anything.
It's doubtful. I backed it up by providing Crowley's own admission of the cat killing. Of course, you might not consider his admission as good enough evidence. Meanwhile, you have not backed up anything.
It is YOUR responsibility to prove YOUR assertions. You have not, and you will not, for you cannot.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete"Crowely's claims to have been a Mason have been discredited many times, primarily by MS masons."
ReplyDeleteThat may be true, but YOU said;
"a way where ALL who desire to be among us as a Freemason are welcomed."
Emphasis mine. This line of thought means that someone who would KILL a cat to prove it did not have nine-lives deserves to be called a Mason. Or that someone who would take advantage of their military power as Grand Orient member, General Andre did to violate the separation of church and state is acting Masonically. I emphatically disagree.
It's been suggested, by you and Mr. Peace both, that this is the kind of Masonry that should be allowed. 'As long as they say they're a Mason, they are.' The proposition offered here is assumed to be that of the Grand Orient of France.
It must readily be admitted that we can see a bit of vindictiveness against all Shriners on the part of Ms. Frost. We can assume some great slight in the past, but leave that aside. Being a Mason, being a Shriner, or any other body does not guarantee the infallibility of the individual. We would hope for an organization filled with great men, and as such I believe with all my heart Masonry is. It is unfortunate that it also contains men who disgrace themselves, but to expand who gets to call themselves a Freemason compounds the issue and dilutes the craft until it is unrecognizable.
In my regular lodge, Freemasonry is extremely in evidence. I doubt my experience is that rare.
Here Francois, let me give you an example of good scholarship utilizing source documents.
ReplyDeleteIf you will recollect mainstream American Masons murdered W. Morgan and then tried to cover it up.
I think murder is not only a Masonic offense but also one punishable under the laws of the United States.
Since you want to talk about history, let's discuss it in graphic detail. ;-)
"Freemasonry, corporate Freemasonry, is chargeable with the stealing of a free citizen, and the murder of a father and husband. The proof of this subject is perfectly conclusive, and is to be found in the reports of the trials of the kidnappers of William Morgan, and in the official accounts given by different special Attornies. It is responsible for having baffled inquiry, for having defeated investigation by the removal of witnesses, and for having produced the acquital of persons notoriously guilty. It has been decided by Judge Marcy in New York, and by two sets of triers at a circuit court held by Judge Gardiner, in the same state, and by a court in Rhode Island, that the obligations of Freemasons disqualified a man from being an impartial juror in a case where a brother mason was a party; and such undoubtedly is the law of the land. The Grand Lodge of New York has given one hundred dollars, in charity, to one of the most guilty kidnappers of Morgan. The Grand Chapter of the same state has given one thousand dollars to aid and sustain other well known kidnappers, and to enable them to escape from justice, at a time when they had no money to bestow, in charity, to widows and orphans. This has recently been established in the trial of a libel suit, brought by Jacob Gould, which was tried at Albany, New York. But perhaps the most remarkable evidence of the binding force of masonic obligations and of the real power of the fraternity, is afforded in the conduct of those who control the newspapers of the country. When the English forger, Stephenson, was kidnapped in a distant state, and brought forcibly to New York, the whole country rang with the alarm which was sounded by the newspapers and every patriot was called on to resent this invasion of personal liberty. But when a free citizen of America was dragged from his family, forcibly carried through the country and drowned in the deep waters of the Niagra, a death-like silence pervaded the newspapers; or if they spoke, it was to notice the outrage in terms of irony and as a trifling and unimportant affair. The papers of every party teemed with the most gross misrepresentations; a simultaneous attack was made on all who were engaged in discovering the offenders; fabricated accounts of Morgan having been seen at different and distant places were incessantly circulated, and every effort was made to delude the public and mislead inquiry. How tremendously powerful must have been that organization, which could produce this shameful treachery of the press to it's public duties! These facts are as notorious as the sun at noon-day, and a stronger proof of their general truth cannot be adduced, than the single circumstance, that to this day, thousands and millions of reading citizens of this country are ignorant of the history of Morgan's abduction and murder, and are totally uninformed of the abominations of freemasonry."
(John Quincy Adams, Adams letters Addressed to W.L. Stone{1833} 23-24, University of Rochester Library Archives).
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteApologies to replying to your post, Yancey, and thinking it was Howard's. No offense intended.
ReplyDeletehowie wrote:
"Again, I need source documents, not the mad ramblings of Crowley or an article about Andre in the encyclopedia."
Yes, and yet you offer NOTHING. Pretty sad display on your part. Of course, you still would claim that a 'madman' is a Freemason:'
"a way where ALL who desire to be among us as a Freemason are welcomed."
Clearly, mad or not, Crowley would fit that criteria. A man who was a prove liar, a madman (as you infer), a cocaine addict, and much else, all as bad or worse than anything here.
Where are your 'source documents' for what happened at Halcyon? Or at the RCG? I need REAL documents. Not just your mad ramblings-clearly they are.
You openly admit that Crowley is a 'madman' (assuming 'mad ramblings' are a qualifier). This is the face of Freemasonry you wish to represent? Remember your words; '
Spinoza:
"Whatsoever is conditioned to exist and act, has been thus conditioned by God."
I actually have the Ethics right here on my desk. I've read it and studied it and greatly admire Spinoza. At one point, you CLAIMED Spinoza was an atheist (or something to the effect). Voltaire, you said, was an AVOWED atheist. You avoided there too, but it should be easy to find where Voltaire 'avowed' anything of the kind. You won't, because you can't. I gave all kinds of evidence to show that they believed in God of some description.
There is NO better 'authority' on Crowley than the person himself; as I'm certain you would agree of Spinoza or any other person. YOU PROVE that these are 'mad ramblings' on Crowley's part.
Oh well, you REFUSE to prove your argument. It's not even an argument suitable for primary school-forget Sophmoric-your argument's just idiotic on your part. My argument stands; you will not show this assertions to be wrong, for you cannot. You will avoid and dodge, and lose all credibility. We see you for your fundamentalist dogma concerning the Grand Orient.
"I think that the statement " All who desire to be among us as freemasons" speaks for itself. The emphasis is on "as freemasons". These would be individuals that believe in, and practice, freemasonry."
ReplyDeleteThe 'wish to be among us as Freemasons' clearly includes those who have no idea of what that means in application. Crowley thought he knew what it was to be a Freemason. Perhaps my definition is not correct either, but I will disagree with Crowley that his definition is correct. It's easy to wish to be something, it's a different matter to have a true understanding of what that something is.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete"If you will recollect mainstream American Masons murdered W. Morgan and then tried to cover it up."
ReplyDeleteIf the masons killed him, Morgan had it coming. ;,) No body, no body of evidence, nobody convicted. In America, that's how it works. I didn't mention that Crowley ritually murdered 150 people. Why not? It's not corroborated by sources and it's not likely either. Just like your assertions that he did not kill a cat are corroborated by anything rational.
Meanwhile, you just attempt to avoid because you know you are wrong. You will not prove them wrong because you cannot prove them wrong. The simple reason is because they are true.
Peter,
ReplyDeleteI agree. Howard and I have differing views on whether or not Crowley and those like him should be accepted as Masons. I say no, and Howard says yes. The differences in definition there will likely not change. On the whole, Howard and I are just having a fun argument-one he has clearly lost. His discussions are full of logical fallacies and other unmentionable substances. This is entertainment and rhetoric on our parts, nothing more.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteFrom the GOUSA site:
ReplyDelete"Suspected criminals, other than traffic violations and minor offenses, will be tried before a jury of their peers and, if found guilty, expelled through due process. No brother will be presumed guilty, and all will be afforded due process."
That's the way it should be. Obviously, that is not how it is. We've seen accused convicted without due process. Along with everyone else, I am given to assume that Judge Tills is guilty. That would be erroneous on my part. Already, the promoters of GOUSA have him behind bars! Let due process hold, and hold your horses! Those chomping at their bits for his conviction, but he hasn't even been CHARGED yet!
Honestly, I do hope he is innocent and is exonerated if so. If he is guilty, I hope justice is served. At least we can wait until we have charges, instead of rushing to judgment as the GOUSA would have us do.
Unquestionably, Howard Roarke of the GOUSA has it as a fact already:
"They demanded PROOF. Well... here's your proof."
Um-Howard-is an investigation proof? Let's not forget a recent allegation from a stripper against a college sports team. Apparently, they were not guilty. How can we rush to judgment? How can we not hold the benefit of the doubt? IF he is innocent, admittedly within the realm of possibility, I hope those who pre-judged him (no pun) will be ashamed. As to the magazine-people have the right to read what they want as long as it was not created illegally. Judge or not.
"Anyone who has ever spoken with me or read any of my papers knows how much I thoroughly despise Crowley."
ReplyDeleteWhich is why I am surprised you said you would welcome him and all those like him with open arms. But you did.
"The term "atheist" can mean many things, depending on which period of history you are discussing. In general terms Spinoza is considered to be an "atheist" and so is Voltaire."
Don't Spinoza and Voltaire have the right to define themselves? Yes. If they did not define themselves thusly-what right have you to do so? In any period of time, you're just being dishonest.
"I'm not here as a professor and your far from a student of any merit."
You are far from a professor of any merit, and I'm not interested in learning the half-baked, moronic statements that you seem given to. I certainly wouldn't pay for a class, as you have no class.
Just a bunch of mad ravings is all I've ever seen from you Howard. You have lost all credibility by not being able to respond to your OWN assertions.
My assertions have held and have not changed at all. You will not prove them wrong, because you CANNOT. Your overuse of ad hominem attacks clearly show you have lost the discussion. You have not shown either the Encyclopedia Brittanica nor Crowley to be 'credible evidence'. Just lame evasion. None of them living up to your assertions.
You CANNOT show evidence to support your assertions, and as predicted, you've only attempted to avoid backing up your assertions. Stop handing out the piles of goat-crap and start backing up your assertions or destroy mine. You have failed to do either. I predict you will not be more successful in the future and that your next response will be as vapid and full of logical errors as your others. Your emotions have not helped you prove ONE thing. Start thinking rationally.
"Then you attempted to change the subject by asking me questions about Halcyon and RRCG,"
ReplyDeleteAlmost got away with that one, Howard Doark. What I asked was:
"Where are your 'source documents' for what happened at Halcyon? Or at the RCG?"
NOTHING about Halcyon or RRCG in particular. Just for your SOURCE DOCUMENTS. YOU tried to change the subject as you have since you made your original assertions, which are unfounded in fact and completely baseless. Kinda like convicting a man before there are even charges. That's the shining example of the GOUSA. Thanks for nothing.
"The Grand Orient of the United States will have an OPEN DOOR policy towards ALL Masons. Our aim is the brotherhood of ALL human beings. You'll be welcome in all of our lodges Bro. Leo."
ReplyDelete(attributed to Jeff at the GOUSA website-likely Jeff Peace)
Sounds like Crowley would INDEED be welcome into the GOUSA, no matter how much you despise him, Howard. Not very much of an 'all human being' statement you make about Crowley.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteHi Peter,
ReplyDeleteI agree wholeheartedly that Crowley does not represent a Mason in any sense. On the other hand, he unquestionably 'wished to be among us as a Mason'. This is the dangerous road to tread, where anyone who wants to be a Mason can be without effort. That is the 'brotherhood without boundaries' concept. Anyone can join simply because they 'wish to be among us'. I'm looking at the subtler message here. Howard definitely has anger toward the Masons, and I cannot believe he is purely motivated by love for the craft. While he may have some, he is also governed by his passions. This often leads to error, and I do not wish to make the error by following along.
I, too, believe in the brotherhood of mankind. I do not believe this is possible without boundaries. This was tried in the 60s communes, and these attempts failed, partially because they had no boundaries. There must be some point where we can say 'this is Masonry' and 'this is not Masonry' or else there will be the point where nothing is Masonry, nothing is brotherhood, nothing is freedom.
We can't work if we throw away our tools. We can't build if we use sugar as mortar; it will dissolve in the rain-and the rain will come.
The story about Paterson is a let down, but shouldn't we consider that he revealed these on his own? I can admire the incredible courage this must have taken. He said he tried it when he was in his early twenties. Of course, he could be lying. He could be telling the truth. I'll take him at his word until more evidence is presented.
ReplyDeleteHis wife and he both admitted to affairs when they were having 'marital strife'. Come on, people! These things happen. It makes him a better person to have fessed-up to it imo. It's too bad the GOUSA cannot give people the benefit of the doubt:
"They demanded PROOF. Well... here's your proof."
Where's the proof? A set of allegations during an ongoing investigation in which nobody's been charged yet, a tasteless pamphlet that is not illegal to own or read, and a man admitting his foibles? Please, don't offer 'proof' until you have some! Of course, the investigation may come up with 'proof', but to claim it's ALREADY proof is just plain stupid!
I take back the 'nobody's been charged yet' statement. It still stands-they haven't been convicted of anything. Wait until something's PROVEN before proof is claimed. Paterson revealed this in 2006, but apparently nobody cared.
ReplyDeleteyes Brothers....
ReplyDeletelets wait till there is proof that Federal Laws and immoral laws were broken.
It is only the men of Halcyon who get labelled guilty first by brothers, not alleged, job resigning,prostitute transporting law officials.
Jester's get a pass on being innocent until proven guilty, but Halcyon has already been convicted by some masons?
WOW...keep defending our best and brightest public representation of the brotherhood, but attack charity minded masons looking out for their community?
The irony is amazing..defense of these social deviants, but condemn masons doing things for charity and the community and taking a stand against a Grand Lodge filled with Jester's....
Now the Grand Lodge of Ohio is going after another youth charity besides Halcyon Charities, the golden gloves, they are trying to scare them off from doing business with the Charities.. another great example by masons on ethics..oh, now I know why they demanded we take down Ethics by Spinoza....The Light now goes on!
So, the grand Lodge of Ohio is attacking 2 local youth charities in the public courts....
I cannot wait till we get to tell our story to the press.....
Big Bad Grand Lodge attacks 2 local charities like a scorned lover, news at 5:00pm...
oh, do not worry about the secret masonic group of judges and police chiefs alledgedly breaking Fdereal Laws, no....and do not condemn Monty in WVA, keep focusing your negative thoughts and energy at condemning Halcyon, since their crimes are the worst of the lot...
Can anyone say:"Karma Police"
I love how reading through the posts, Francois strictly attacks the grand orient? I did not see anything regarding the grand Orient within the article?
ReplyDeleteHey Francois, see a specialists to let loose YOUR fixation on the Grand Orient!
The Grand Orient did it
The Grand Orient did it
The Grand Orient is the devil
The Grand Orient will be the downfall to innocent American souls
The grand Orient did it
the Grand Orient is guilty of something
The Grand Orient infiltrated the Jester's and id this
The grand Master of Ohio is a current Jester
Halcyon is the devils army
the Grand Orient is the enemy
The Grand Orient was behind 911
the Grand Orient shot Kennedy
the Grand Orient sunk the Louisitania
The Grand Orient started the Yom Kippor War
The Grand Orient raised taxes
the Grand Orient imploded tower 7
the Grand Orient fomented the civil war
The grand Orient introduced viagria to weaken the morals of Jesters
The grand orient blah blah blah
the grand orient crucified Jesus..
What do you sya Francois, what else have it missed ?
So, can we stay on topic?
start you own anti-Grand Orient blog and we will come read it, instead the mantra being played out here?
OK..
Come to grips with that which you fear!
The French are comming sounds alot better than the British are comming!
Revolutions are scary Francois, your neck itching?
subpoena sent to The Golden Gloves Youth Boxing Charity for doing business with Halcyon Charities?
ReplyDeleteWTF now guys!
As I was reading the exchange of comments above, I was reminded of a story my grandfather once told me:
ReplyDeleteMany years ago, a scholar was traveling through the wilderness when he came to a river that was too wide and swift for his horse to cross. His progress being thereby impeded, he rode along the river's edge until he came to a hand-drawn ferry, with ropes extending from one side of the river to the other.
After securing a place on the ferry, the scholar engaged the ferryman in conversation to pass the time. "Have you ever studied Shakespeare," the scholar asked? "No," replied the ferryman, "I never got around to that." "Then you've lost a part of your life," the scholar said.
"Have you ever studied algebra," the scholar inquired further? "No," replied the ferryman, "I never got around to that either." "Then you've lost another part of your life," replied the scholar.
The conversation continued in similar course until the ferry reached the middle of the river. Suddenly, the ropes broke and the ferry began rushing downstream toward the crashing shoals.
"Have you ever studied swimming," shouted the ferryman? "No, I never got around to that," came the scholar's reply. "Then," the ferryman replied, "you've lost all of your life."
Personally, I don't know if Aleister Crowley was a Mason, or if Voltaire was an atheist, and moreover, I really don't care. Neither of them lived to see the world in which we live, and if they had, they might have formed different opinions.
But today is NOT their time -- it's ours. In their day, men of the past chose their own paths, and we must likewise choose ours.
It seems to me that all too often, "conversations" here amount to little more than rearranging the deck chairs on the "Titanic." Why waste so much time and effort debating things that can't be proven or disproven, and most certainly can't be changed, while largely ignoring what's going on right now -- things that perhaps could be changed with sufficient inclination and effort?
An ever-increasing number of Masons are now suffering the consequences of official misconduct. I'm not talking about men who've been dead for centuries, I'm talking about men who are still alive today. We read reports of the wrongs committed against them, yet we continue distracting ourselves from the urgent problems of our own time.
Is that really much different than men who debate the minutia of lectures and rituals, while their lodges go bankrupt and disintegrate around them?
-- Diogenes
"But today is NOT their time -- it's ours. In their day, men of the past chose their own paths, and we must likewise choose ours.
ReplyDeleteIt seems to me that all too often, "conversations" here amount to little more than rearranging the deck chairs on the "Titanic." Why waste so much time and effort debating things that can't be proven or disproven, and most certainly can't be changed, while largely ignoring what's going on right now -- things that perhaps could be changed with sufficient inclination and effort?
An ever-increasing number of Masons are now suffering the consequences of official misconduct. I'm not talking about men who've been dead for centuries, I'm talking about men who are still alive today. We read reports of the wrongs committed against them, yet we continue distracting ourselves from the urgent problems of our own time.
Is that really much different than men who debate the minutia of lectures and rituals, while their lodges go bankrupt and disintegrate around them?" - Diogenes
I re-posted this because it needed to be posted again.
I apologize my brother. The failure is entirely mine. I let myself get lost in the rhetoric and emotion of the argument and lost focus on all that was truly important.
I ask the forgiveness of all whom I have let down by neglecting my primary duties while engaging in a petty intellectual battle.
You words strike me harder than steel.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDelete"It seems to me that all too often, "conversations" here amount to little more than rearranging the deck chairs on the "Titanic." Why waste so much time and effort debating things that can't be proven or disproven, and most certainly can't be changed, while largely ignoring what's going on right now -- things that perhaps could be changed with sufficient inclination and effort?"
ReplyDeleteYou're absolutely right, Diogenes. Of course, in the lodge we are paying close attention to what is going on RIGHT NOW. None of this here means ANYTHING. What goes on in YOUR lodge and how it is handled is the only thing that means ANYTHING. We've added several younger brothers in this past year and are concentrating on education.
The brethren are moving forward and doing great work in our community. I am proud of our lodge and proud to know the brothers in my lodge. I am humbled that I can work with such great brethren. We meet on the level, and the camaraderie is palpable at our meetings. We are moving forward into the bright future! Of course, none of the brethren in my lodge hang out here. I do for the amusement park atmosphere.
(reposted)
ReplyDelete2 ball
I posted a reply, but the admin must have thought it was too rough. I guess I'll couch it in even softer terms than the marhmallow terms I used previously.
I do not think any of these things about the G.O. I do think that technically, it has been stated that they would be welcome. All those things on your list and more according to what is posted about and by the GOUSA. I pointed that out humorously, and it made some people hot under the collar as I intended.
As far as Halcyon goes, I will wait for the verdict. As far as the Jesters go, I will wait for the verdict. NEITHER conviction would be a cause for celebration. EITHER honest acquital would be. We'll see. I think we should wait for the facts before judging these men in the jesters or those in Halcyon. I hope justice is served, and that the wrongdoers (if any) in Halcyon or in the Jesters get the punishments they deserve.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteTruth be told, EVERY fraternal orginization have members that operate outside the law or do unethical things. That dosen't make it right and I'm not excusing their actions, but Fraternal orginizations shouldn't be blamed for the actions of some of their members. When the Tailhook scandal happened in the Navy in the early 90's, you would have thought that ALL the pilots in the Navy acted the way those Pilots did in Las Vegas. The actions of some do bring bad print. But let YOUR actions speak for you. Make it clear to others who know that you are a Mason, that your actions and daily living are above reproach.
ReplyDelete